Driving Growth Through Culture: Wendy Brand’s Proven Strategies

Freddy D
00:02:59.100 – 00:03:48.646
Yeah, no, it’s very important and great backstory because we just got done doing a big, huge cruise. We went through the South Pacific from Hawaii all the way down To Sydney, Australia. It was about three day cruise.

It was a multicultural customers, the workforce and everything else. And yet everybody seemed to operate in great synchronization. People were happy, they were smiling.

So it’s really important, the culture that you have because that transcends to the customers, that transcends to your suppliers, that transcends to your distributors and your complementary businesses. So it really starts with the mindset of the business and that transcends throughout the whole ecosystem of that business.

Wendy Brand
00:03:48.798 – 00:04:22.251
Yeah. You bring up a great example, the unique culture of a cruise ship.

I was this young 23 year old from Texas coming to work with people from all different countries. The staff is just, it’s from a variety of different countries, positions on the ship.

And it really set me up for when I worked in global roles in my future, understanding how to work with different cultures. But you’re right, especially in that hospitality environment, really putting a show on for the customers is really what you’re doing there.

Freddy D
00:04:22.355 – 00:04:27.419
Yeah. Because we were on the thing for three weeks and we never had any issues whatsoever. Zero.

Wendy Brand
00:04:27.539 – 00:04:27.819
Right.

Freddy D
00:04:27.859 – 00:04:39.035
I mean the service was great, people were friendly and we met some great people from different cultures that were working on the ship that we got to know as well as some of the guests that were from different countries as well.

Wendy Brand
00:04:39.107 – 00:05:09.866
Yeah. What we know is that organizations that focus on their culture really experience four times the revenue growth of other companies.

So we know that when you’re intentional about your culture and you think, think about your people, the ones that are doing the work for your customers, it really will pay off.

And I think sometimes that’s the piece that business leaders need to hear is the impact that it will have on the growth of their business and the financial impact that can have when you invest in your people and you’re intentional about your culture.

Freddy D
00:05:09.978 – 00:05:56.616
Oh, absolutely correct. Because that’s one of the things I wrote about my book. My book is called Creating Business Superfans. And it’s really all about the culture.

And one of the things that I think you and I go different is there’s people that talk about X, which is employee experience. Okay.

I look at that as a silo and then there’s people that talk about cx and I look at that as another silo because in reality, and I think you’ll agree with me on this, those two need to work together. You’ve got the suppliers that nobody ever talks about, then you’ve got the distributors that nobody talks about.

You’ve got complementary businesses that nobody talk about. You’ve got your banker not even a complimentary business. It’s a separate business. And in reality, they’re all connected.

Wendy Brand
00:05:56.728 – 00:05:57.384
That’s right.

Freddy D
00:05:57.472 – 00:06:26.976
I’m pioneering a new term called total experience because it incorporates everybody into the equation. Just like you said, if a business understands that their team is the driving force of their business, that energy carries through.

Because if they’re talking to a prospective customer, right, they’re not happy about their environment, they’re not happy about that company, they’re not appreciated, etc. That tonality is going to come across.

Wendy Brand
00:06:27.128 – 00:06:27.920
That’s right.

Freddy D
00:06:28.040 – 00:06:32.912
That prospective customer is going, you know, something’s just not right. They’re going to go somewhere else.

Wendy Brand
00:06:33.056 – 00:07:24.344
Right. So there’s an alignment that has to happen. And I think we’re closer together than you think.

So when I talk about culture, and I start out talking about a culture compass, that’s really the mission, the vision and the core values. Because I believe that culture isn’t the HR role. Right.

It’s culture can be driven from the top when the leader is clear about the vision, the reason that we’re here, and those core values, how they want employees to get things done.

And so it’s really about once you set that culture compass and it’s visible not just to the employee, but to the customer as well, it streamlines operations, it can streamline the employee experience, the customer experience, as you say, for that total experience, with just the simple step of being intentional about a mission, vision and core values.

Freddy D
00:07:24.472 – 00:08:10.064
Right.

Because that also transcends to, let’s say it’s a supplier and you’re getting products and you know, you’ve appreciated that supplier, you sent them a birthday card and things like that.

And then all of a sudden you’re in a crunch and you need something, and then someone else is also in a crunch and they need something from the same supplier who you think they’re going to favor and take care of, the one that’s always appreciated them and everything else, they’re going to get the priority. And I always say it’s the little things that are the big things.

And just by acknowledging that particular supplier and thanking them and stuff like that, I had someone talk about them appreciating the UPS driver, but they had a package that lost and that UPS driver went out of their way and found the lost package.

Wendy Brand
00:08:10.192 – 00:08:38.526
Yeah, it’s really looking at business as a whole. I think, like you said, the total experience.

And when you’re talking about the supplier, it reminds me of some Six Sigma work that I did with and using sipoc. Right. You look at the suppliers, the inputs, the process, the output, and the consumers.

You really look at that whole what’s working, what’s not working, from starting from the supplier, because they are kind of the input to that entire organizational process.

Freddy D
00:08:38.678 – 00:08:48.942
Right.

So share with us a story of how you went into an organization and transformed their culture and what they were before you walked in that they look like after you walked out.

Wendy Brand
00:08:49.046 – 00:11:43.976
Yeah. Well, I’ll start by telling kind of where I first saw great culture. Like I mentioned, I’ve seen it work in organizations.

I’ve seen it not work in organizations.

And it was really when I worked at this tech organization that’s based in San Antonio and saw all of the things that they were doing with their core values. And it wasn’t just talk. It was really, people were living and breathing. The CEO was being transparent about what was happening.

Employees were connecting with others through resource groups, and all of it was working, and profits were soaring. And so I took really a model from Christine Mosloch, defined what causes burnout in employees.

And what she did is she looked at the role of the individual in burnout and the role of the organization in burnout. And what she found was that there are six things that cause employees to burn out in an organization.

And so my framework called Thrive Culture is based on really identifying those six things in an organization that you can do to create an intentional culture and prevent burnout, increase revenue. And so work that I have done with organizations really starts by first, again, looking at the culture compass.

And I’ll give an example of a nonprofit that I worked with recently. Where we went in, they had the mission and vision, they had it for years, but they did not have core values defined.

So we went in, we defined the core values, and we begin to work through the other pieces of the Thrive culture framework.

So tribal values, so not just having core values, but making sure that they are integrated through performance management, through the hiring process, that they really show up as ways make it clear to employees what’s expected. Then we went in and looked at their processes. So did they have helpful processes and systems in place?

There was a client process that was broken, and so we went in and fixed that changed Some of the people that were working on that team, we put a responsive listening strategy in place where we do employee surveys, but the R and responsive is not just about having a culture survey or an engagement survey, but it’s following up with those employees to say what’s working or what’s not. And then there’s three other pieces of it. But those were the three where we started focusing and we began to see.

We’ll do another baseline survey again in two months. But already all of the staff is completely. All of the positions are completely filled.

They were having an extreme turnover problem when I started working with them over a year ago, and now all positions are filled. We’ll see when we get this engagement survey in the next two weeks how that’s doing.

But I also do leadership coaching in that organization, and so I’m able to hear firsthand just some of the things that are helping employees individually.

Freddy D
00:11:44.088 – 00:11:47.592
What was the biggest broken thing that you found in that organization?

Wendy Brand
00:11:47.736 – 00:12:29.034
I found this in several organizations where there’s a fear of really understanding what the root problem is. A lot of times leaders don’t really want to know or they think they know.

But once we start digging in and talking to employees and understanding where some of the issues are, looking at the actual processes, I almost feel like sometimes people aren’t being straightforward enough to say what the issue really is. For fear of having to let go of people that have been there for a long time or needing to make changes in the organizational structure.

They’ve done things that this way for so long. That kind of fear of change.

Freddy D
00:12:29.202 – 00:13:33.380
And sometimes the leader has got to get themselves out of their own way because sometimes that’s the crux of the problem in a lot of organizations. Like you said, you provide leadership training.

I’ve worked with several companies in the past where they grew the business to a certain level, but they didn’t have the skill set and the knowledge and the engagement with the team to take it to a whole nother level. And they were stuck at a perpetual turnover situation because they had no sops in place.

They onboarded somebody, they trained them verbally for a week, and then next week they’re doing their job. And now they make a mistake. So they got chastised. And not in private, they chastised them publicly.

So now that instantly creates a very negative situation because now everybody’s going to go, man, I don’t want to be that person. And now that person is humiliated, doesn’t want to go into the office anymore.

So they’re just doing the bare minimum of their job and they’re already looking for another job, right?

Wendy Brand
00:13:33.500 – 00:13:57.488
Yeah. And I’ve definitely turned clients away that the leader wasn’t.

After doing some coaching with the leader, I saw that they weren’t interested in making changes because I have my own business. I get to decide who I work with, and I don’t want to try to convince people that they need to be intentional about their culture.

I want to work with leaders that already get it and are just looking for the tools and guidance to put in place.

Freddy D
00:13:57.624 – 00:14:47.708
If you treat your people well and you create what I call creating super fans out of the employees they’re feeling energized. My wife, she works for a company. She’s been there seven years, a great culture. She works from home. She’s been working from home for seven years.

But they do team events, they have prizes, they have contests and a multitude of different things. And she loves working there because the culture is a great culture. And she’s even making less money. We were actually talking about it last night.

She was going to got my statement stuff, and I’ve made less money, but it’s still a great company to work for. And that comes across when they’re talking to prospective customers. Because she sells hearing aids. Okay.

So, you know, you gotta have a skill set to be able to do that. They’re not five bucks.

Wendy Brand
00:14:47.884 – 00:14:48.908
Yeah, right.

Freddy D
00:14:49.044 – 00:15:09.852
But the thing is, she feels great about the company she works for when she has to send somebody to a clinic and she has to deal with the provider. And that’s all inner working. And if it was not a successful company and with a horrible culture, they wouldn’t be where they’re at.

And they’re over north of $100 million in sales.

Wendy Brand
00:15:09.996 – 00:15:58.592
Yeah, I think that’s one of the biggest misnomers that I hear is that people are leaving because of pay. Now that sometimes that’s truly the case. But when we start digging in, I learn quickly that it’s not a pay issue.

I mean, absolutely, you should be paying your people fairly, market wage or better, if you can. People want to feel a part of the mission. They want to feel engaged. Really.

At the end of the day, employees want to feel like what they’re doing is contributing value to the organization. And it’s up to us as leaders to show them. Here’s where you tie in. Here’s the vision, here’s the mission, here’s what your role is doing to help that.

And once we make that connection for people, I mean, nobody wants to come to work and, like, do a crappy job. People want to feel like they’re adding value every day.

Freddy D
00:15:58.696 – 00:16:05.120
Well, one of my quotes in my book is people will crawl through broken glass for appreciation and recognition. Right?

Wendy Brand
00:16:05.240 – 00:16:06.368
Yeah, it’s true.

Freddy D
00:16:06.464 – 00:16:29.516
Again, it goes back to the little things are the big things. And so, like her, she’s a super fan of that company.

So she tells Everybody about the great company she works and she wears the shirt that they send her, wears around all that stuff. So she’s promoting that company. And that’s one of the things I talk about in the book, is you can’t buy that kind of pr.

Wendy Brand
00:16:29.668 – 00:16:30.172
Right.

Freddy D
00:16:30.276 – 00:16:58.932
And then that transcends to customers because then they have. The customer has a great experience, the supplier has a great experience. A distributor, or in her case it would be the provider helps out.

And so they’re a super fan because they’re talking up, oh, you’re dealing with that company. Great company, love working with them.

Whole different thing that reinforces the decision that the customer did in buying the product versus, oh, them. You’re with them. Yeah, Just that sentence right there kills it.

Wendy Brand
00:16:59.036 – 00:17:50.360
Yes.

And the tech company that I mentioned where I really experienced the best culture, they literally took culture seriously from the time before you even are a candidate all the way to when people leave. Unfortunately, I was in HR at the time when we were having to do some layoffs.

But the way that we treated those employees during those layoffs, we created a job fair for the people that we were laying off. We first gave them access to any positions that were open within the organization if it was a good fit for them.

And then we called companies across the state and said, we’re going to have a job fair. If you have openings, we want you to come here. Not angry. They understood and they already had a job by the time they left.

So the way you treat people on the way in and the way out makes a huge difference in how they talk about you to the public.

Freddy D
00:17:50.480 – 00:17:53.368
Yeah. Because either you create a super fan or you don’t.

Wendy Brand
00:17:53.464 – 00:17:53.960
That’s right.

Freddy D
00:17:54.000 – 00:18:14.986
And a super fan is going to be talking positive to everybody. And likewise, if it’s a bad experience, they’re going to be talking negative about you to everybody, if not even more so.

Let’s go into some of the metrics that you use and do things to really do what you do with transforming cultures.

Wendy Brand
00:18:15.098 – 00:19:50.350
Yeah, absolutely.

So when we look at lagging indicators like turnover that we can look at to see what’s happening, but really I like to use culture surveys as leading indicators for what is happening at the time, whether employees are happy or not.

And then we do an assessment again, we’ll look at the culture compass to determine whether that mission, vision and core values need, if they need to be validated.

But then we start working through the six pillars of that thrive culture, like I mentioned, the tribal values, the helpful processes and systems, the responsive listening strategy. But then the last three are inspiring inclusivity and belonging.

Really creating a connection for employees in the organization, helping them find others that are like them.

It’s great to have diversity of thought in a culture, but also allowing people to connect with those that are like them makes them feel like they like a sense of belonging. V is having visible career and development paths. So making sure that. Sure, there’s training available or I mean, there’s not a career path. Right.

Maybe you’ve just got a couple layers. There’s things you can do to help employees develop as an individual contributor. And then the E is the empowering rewards and recognition.

So making sure, like I said before, that you’re paying at least market value, but also how are you rewarding? And so I really use that, all six of those components as a lens to dive into the culture and look at what’s working, what’s not.

What do you have in place? Where can we adjust and move forward?

Freddy D
00:19:50.470 – 00:20:33.568
Yeah. No. Very well thought through system that you’re using. Because I remember when I first got into the SaaS world, back when it began like 45 years ago.

And like, I mean, really when it began. But we had a great organization early on. We had some great managers.

And every Friday we would go across the street to the restaurant happy hour, and basically the whole office went. It wasn’t just a few people, it was pretty much the whole office went. And we would just hang out on a Friday night. But it built relationships.

And I still have, 45 years later, I still have friendships with some of those people, even though our lives have gone in different directions because of the culture that was created.

Wendy Brand
00:20:33.664 – 00:20:55.150
Yeah. Gallup has a metric that they talk about a lot, that if you have a best friend at work, you’re 50% more likely to stay in the organization.

And I think that’s so important. Right. They’re showing statistically that how important it is to have people that you feel like you can trust and rely on at work.

Because it’s really where we spend the majority of our day.

Freddy D
00:20:55.270 – 00:21:15.550
We used to go camping. We would go camping, we’d go boating, go to ball games. We did all kinds of fun stuff as a group.

And like, say, not my best friend, but we’re still friends. And we started on the same day and was like, we didn’t know anybody. So let’s just hang out together. And we’re still friends 45 years later.

Wendy Brand
00:21:15.670 – 00:21:35.918
Yeah. You don’t have to spend a lot of money. Right. To make that happen in your organization. It doesn’t have to Be expensive trips or.

Although when you’re winning, it’s good to do those things. But you don’t have to spend a ton of money on just bringing people together. It’s really more about time. Right.

Giving them the time to do that and build those bonds.

Freddy D
00:21:36.014 – 00:22:21.162
Yeah. It’s recognizing people’s birthdays at work. It’s celebrating an accomplishment.

When I was running another SaaS company and we hit a certain milestone in sales because I was in charge of global sales and marketing for the company, unbeknownst to anybody, I just invited everybody into the conference room. Well, I had brought in food and everything else, and we had passed a financial threshold on sales.

And so I brought everybody, the developers, everything. Important meeting. We got to get in there, be there in 15 minutes. Nobody knew what was going on. And the whole intent was to create that surprise.

And here we are to celebrate and thank you, and had some champagne and stuff like that. And everybody was just energized. And everybody just left going, yes, we did it.

Wendy Brand
00:22:21.266 – 00:22:21.738
Yeah.

Freddy D
00:22:21.834 – 00:22:24.138
And again, little things are the big things.

Wendy Brand
00:22:24.274 – 00:23:06.152
It really goes a long way.

And there’s also statistics that say that employees who feel strongly connected to their company’s culture, like the example that you’re giving with connecting with your peers, I mean, that’s really feeling that connection to culture.

They feel more responsible for the quality of products and services, and they also have the speed and agility to meet customer and marketplace change. So when you’re creating that employee engagement, it is impacting the customer. We’re just more engaged, more productive.

I think some leaders sometimes feel like, well, that’s taking time away from work, but you have to give time for that, engaging in other things. I think to really impact productivity in a positive way.

Freddy D
00:23:06.256 – 00:23:18.168
Correct. Because you’re really not taking time away from work. Because Sir Richard Branson says it the best. It’s called life.

There is no difference between work and home life. It’s called life.

Wendy Brand
00:23:18.304 – 00:23:18.888
That’s right.

Freddy D
00:23:18.944 – 00:23:40.230
And you’re living it. So get over it and understand that it’s all part of that process.

And someone that’s energized and happy is going to go above and beyond and stay after and do the extra things. Because they’re a super fan of the company that they’re working for.

So they have no problem going above and beyond or coming in on a Saturday or whatever it is.

Wendy Brand
00:23:40.350 – 00:23:40.678
Right.

Freddy D
00:23:40.734 – 00:23:49.254
Versus boom. It’s a drill sergeant. And this is how it is. And this is how we run the company. They’re going to do the bare minimum, and that’s it?

Wendy Brand
00:23:49.342 – 00:25:24.868
That’s right.

I’ll say to the importance of having the culture compass again with the mission, vision and values, because I know it sounds like such a simple thing, but one of the things when I burned out two different times in an organization, it was because of a values mismatch. So I enjoyed the work I was doing. I liked some of the people that I worked with.

But there was fundamentally a values mismatch for me in that organization. And it wasn’t until the second time that I burned out that I realized that was the case.

And what I learned was what was not a good culture for me was actually a good culture for others. There were people that enjoyed working in that organization because the values align for them.

So sometimes just because a culture doesn’t feel like a fit for some employees doesn’t mean that it’s a bad culture. It just may not be the right culture for them.

And so when we’re as leaders or founders, entrepreneurs, as we’re building businesses, the more intentional we are about making it clear this is what our culture is about, this is who we are. This is what it looks like to be here. Being honest with that allows employees to either accept it or not accept it.

And it’s okay if they don’t and they want to go elsewhere, but those that stay really can enjoy it. Jim Collins, in one of my favorite books, Good to Great, one of the things that he talks about is cult like culture.

But in a cult like culture, while it’s great for the business, employees are either fully bought in or they’re not bought in at all. And really visionary organizations have cult like culture, but it’s not for everybody.

Freddy D
00:25:24.964 – 00:26:13.022
Right. And that goes back to. I had a guest on many episodes back that really talked about the culture aspect.

And when you’re hiring, like you just mentioned, you make sure that they’re going to fit into the culture because if they don’t fit, they can also screw up the culture in the company because you got someone that now is unhappy and so now they’re poisoning everybody else into the company and what you may have had, and I’ve experienced, experienced this not too long ago in a company where we had somebody that thought that they knew it all and started to talk about this person and that person and started all kinds of back talking. And the next thing you know, everybody’s kind of not happy and it just completely screwed everything up until we got rid of that person.

And it took a while to put it back together.

Wendy Brand
00:26:13.126 – 00:26:53.584
Yeah, it can spoil the whole bunch. You’re Absolutely right.

One of the things I’m working on with one of my clients right now is a hiring guide and we’re taking those core values and we’ve now taken it a layer deeper and talked about the behaviors. So if these are the core values, what are the behaviors that we’re looking for? So when you walk into the company, what do you see?

How are people treating each other? How are they treating the customer?

And then we’ve taken those behaviors and created competencies to go into a hiring guide so that when we hire into that organization, these are the competencies that we’re looking for. They align with the culture. So hopefully we’re catching it on the front end and we’re not bringing in a bad seed.

Freddy D
00:26:53.712 – 00:27:11.334
Right. So what would be a good action item for midsize business owner to look at into his environment?

Because sometimes you got to step back and take a peek because you’re in the mix or you’re in the weeds and sometimes you can’t see what’s really going on.

Wendy Brand
00:27:11.422 – 00:27:39.272
Yeah, that’s a great question.

I think probably looking at what employees are saying, I mean really listening, having some one on one conversations with employees, maybe not even your direct reports. If you have a layer or two, we call those step levels.

Going down a step and having some one on ones with the frontline employees to really listen and do that over maybe a three or four week time period and see what you hear and don’t be afraid of what you might hear. Go with an open mind.

Freddy D
00:27:39.366 – 00:28:04.004
All right. Don’t judge, keep it closed.

Listen, allow people to make it anonymous and then just tell everybody, don’t write it, Put it in the computer and print it out so we can’t even tell handwriting, so it’s completely anonymous. And then have it submitted and then you’ll be surprised the feedback that you’ll get.

And sometimes it’s very constructive things goes, oh yeah, stare me in the face. I never saw it.

Wendy Brand
00:28:04.092 – 00:28:44.324
That’s right. A good old fashioned comment box. Yeah, have people type up their stuff, put it in a comment box, give them 30 days to do it.

Just to give them time to think through it. And then you’ve got time to take that box back to your office, sort through it and give yourself time to process so that you’re not defensive.

But I always do that. The responsive listening strategy. I mean now we’re talking about a listening strategy by you listening.

Again, when I talk about responsive, don’t just never come back to them and say anything about what they did when you Come back to them the next time.

If you didn’t say anything about what they’ve shared with you, they’re going to stop trusting that you really want to listen and they’re going to stop responding.

Freddy D
00:28:44.452 – 00:28:46.932
They think it’s just going into a voided box.

Wendy Brand
00:28:47.076 – 00:28:47.940
That’s right.

Freddy D
00:28:48.060 – 00:29:03.652
So a good leader would turn around and says, hey, I got everybody’s comments and some of them were tough to swallow, but thank you for being authentic and direct and I’m going to work on myself to be a better leader. People will respect that.

Wendy Brand
00:29:03.756 – 00:29:31.914
Yes, absolutely. Humility goes a long way and if there are things that they’re asking for in the business that you can’t do, that’s okay.

Even coming back to them and saying, look, you’ve asked for a four day work week. Sorry, we’re not going to be able to do a four day work week here. But you’ve also asked for more time off in your PTO package.

Okay, I’m going to give you guys an extra vacation day. Like a little give and take. Being honest about what you can’t do and honest about what you can, I think goes a long way.

Freddy D
00:29:32.022 – 00:29:32.610
Absolutely.

Wendy Brand
00:29:32.690 – 00:29:33.090
Yeah.

Freddy D
00:29:33.170 – 00:29:46.786
Wendy, it’s been great having you on the show. Phenomenal conversation, great insights on culture. We could probably talk about this for several hours. Yes. Do you have anything?

We talked about it before show. You might have like a quiz or something for our listeners.

Wendy Brand
00:29:46.898 – 00:30:05.278
I’d love to share my quiz. It’s a free quiz. You just go to culturecoachwindy.com forward/quiz and it’s a quiz.

It’s just a simple 10 question quiz that’s really based on that Thrive culture framework that I’ve talked about. If you want to talk more about it, obviously reach out. Happy to talk culture with anybody.

Freddy D
00:30:05.374 – 00:30:07.454
Based on that note, how can people find you?

Wendy Brand
00:30:07.542 – 00:30:15.806
My website, culturecoach wendy.com I also have a podcast, the Culture Coach and I’m always on LinkedIn. Wendy Brand, thank you Wendy.

Freddy D
00:30:15.838 – 00:30:21.246
It’s been a pleasure having you on the Business Superfam podcast show. We look forward to having you on the show down the road.

Wendy Brand
00:30:21.318 – 00:30:23.270
It has been such a delight. Thank you so much.